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[Music]  good morning everyone good morning thank  you for a Bluewater cruisin association  for hosting this event now we're going  to talk about inverters or inverter  chargers a little bit more complicated  and I saw another spec sheet from  another builder we do a lot of design  work and I was looking at a spec sheet  from a builder reputable builder and in  the spec sheet there was talking about a  magnum inverter charger with three  outputs I was like wow that's amazing  doesn't exist sounds promising there's  no such thing and even builders  sometimes it's confusing honestly you  can't be everything to everyone in life  and when you have any River Charger  unless you have an old freedom inverter  charger which had echo chargers on there  99% of us have a single output inverter  charger meaning you can only charge one  battery bank and only one battery bank  alone is charge from an inverter charger  directly ok there's other ways of  sharing that charge through other  devices but the inverter charger is a  single output device Magnum Victor on  master volt there's no such thing as two  outputs on an inverter charger it's an  inverter charger it doesn't do multiple  battery mechs and so if you look at this  inverter here it's only going to be  connected to one battery bank and one  battery bank alone okay this is very  important your inverter does not or  inverter charger is not going to be  charging especially multiple battery  banks it can only be connected to one  battery there's only one DC supply so  when it inverts it pulls when it charges  it pushes right here I'm showing what an  inverter service disconnect is by the  way an inverter manual is about 70 to  100 pages that is way too much reading  for anyone okay I would say that about  98% of all inverter chargers are badly  installed on all boats so if you have an  inverter charger on your boat i  high-five an owner when i find a boat  with a properly installed inverter  charger i lately if I had champagne I  pop a champagne bottle open that is how  rare it happens I get to see a boat with  a properly installed inverter  maybe once a year maybe every inverter  charger I've ever seen is badly  installed doesn't matter whose did it  what it is there's no way they're gonna  read their manual it can't be bothered  it's a hundred pages it's so complicated  why do they and it looks so simple I  mean it came in the box it seems so  innocent it's like the person that  doesn't read the IKEA instructions when  they're building a piece of furniture  hey this is easy I got this how many of  you have successfully built anything  with IKEA without reading the  instructions it's impossible you can't  do it it's impossible it's never  happened you miss a step you're screwed  you missed a step you didn't read the  instructions you're screwed and so we'll  talk about all the screw-ups ago with  inverter chargers and there's so many  because the manual is just so damn thick  all right so what's the purpose of an  inverter first we talked about the word  converter before remember I said  converter goes this way inverter goes  this way right so an inverter creates AC  that's the purpose  AC is like outlets in our houses all our  homes are run on AC right so you're  gonna do it to run microwave you could  run it to run a TV you could like we  have a Nespresso machine on our boat it  could be whatever you could even run a  hot water tank you shouldn't but you  could you could run on some big boats  we'll run air conditioning units off of  it  can do it now it gets a huge inverter  system but you can do I have got owners  that have 80 90 footers we wash washing  machines dryers but they have a battery  bank and they're like the size of this  area you know of course it's doable and  we run you know you can run a town on an  inverter it happens you can do whatever  you want it's definitely doable but you  need a hell of a battery bank to do it  for most of us we're gonna reduce our  consumption by looming the amount of  things that we can do off an inverter  right it's like having a black Amex  if I had a black Amex and I could spend  as much money as I want it'd be fun for  a little while until I realized that I'd  have to pay the bill and the problem  with an inverter is that draws power at  a very very high rate and so you want to  limit your ability to not do things that  would be foolish like running a heater  off an inverter right we're running a  battery charger off of an inverter right  is the opposite of  da Vinci machine right you can't create  AC to give back DC you're just gonna go  into a spiral of death and your  battery's gonna drain itself and I see  battery chargers running off inverse all  the time about 10% of the boats have  battery chargers connected to the  inverter unrelated their batteries die  all the time and they don't know the  owners don't know it's unbeknown to them  they thought that whoever did it would  have done it smart you know you wouldn't  run a battery charger from an inverter  because you're literally taking money  from yourself to pay back yourself and  there's a middleman in the middle and  every time you do a transaction they're  taking 15 points so you lose 15 points  15 points and eventually you run out of  money so you can't have certain loads  running off of an inverter okay one of  the questions I got on YouTube was well  what's wattage what does that mean so  2000 watt 200 watt 3000 watt some people  have 6000 watt inverters we stack them I  was on a boat it had 20,000 watt  inverters it was like like crazy does it  matter  is the question is what are you gonna  run on your boat right what do you need  to run on your boat  some people like they say to me they say  Jeff I want to run a coffee pot or a  microwave well that's less than 2,000  about 1200 1500 some people say I want  to run two things at the same time I  want a convection oven and I want a  coffee pot at the same time now you  start adding up maybe four thousand  right or Jeff I just want to run a TV  and I just want to charge a laptop  nothing else 300 watt right so all our  appliances have wattage readings on them  and so you end up sizing all the things  you might load on the inverter and you  decide am I gonna run them concurrently  like a hair dress a hairdryer and the  microwave and a coffee pot at the same  time  why will you do on a sailboat which I  encourage people to do is like well how  about you run them sequentially you know  do the hairdryer first then say okay  we're done with a hairdryer then we'll  do a microwave once we're done with a  microwave then we'll do a Nespresso but  running them concurrently means you get  a huge inverter large battery bank huge  cables and so it sounds great until you  realize the price you have to pay okay  so that's really essential is the  wattage of the inverter and they  from as low as a hundred watts up to  single units or even 5000 and there's  bigger commercial units there's no end  but on boats it's about five thousand  and then after that you end up stacking  them you'll end up stacking multiple  them together that they work together to  make you run larger loads okay  so on the AC side the diagram before  that was showing that's just the DC side  but look at how complicated the AC side  of an inverter is right an inverter is  one of those things that come off of the  main AC panel it goes into this device  and then it goes back in and it goes  through what are called inverted lows or  AC pass through these lows over here the  fridge they see outlets of microwave  they can run off the inverter or they  can run off shore power or they can run  off the generator and so do you notice  how these two items are sort of a why  right two inputs going to one output and  then this goes in and if this sense is  AC it says I know you told me to be an  inverter but that's silly you don't mean  it  you mean when you lose AC I'll invert  for you it's a conditional inverter and  that's called pass-through that is  probably one of the myths understood  items on boats and inverters by far  number one there's no second place you  need you can have your inverter having  loads go through it even when you're on  shore power because they want the  ability of having automatic switching  right there on it they're doing  basically an automatic why if I sense AC  and you ask me to be an inverter I won't  do it  you're silly you don't really mean that  because I've got AC I'll just let it  through pass through if you ask me to be  an inverter and I don't have AC I'll  invert for you so inverters are  generally conditional they're only  inverting if they don't sense AC and  that's pretty much like 95% of all  inverters okay remember Chargers have to  be marine I can't emphasize that enough  inverters have to be marine if you take  a shortcut there welcome to a world of  hurt world or hurt and if you have a  powerboat and you got two props and some  props are not like $100 there are  thousands of dollars  your shafts are big you are in a world  of pain a world of pain and when that  happens by the way you don't lose a weak  K like we do a lot of galvanic surveys  and you know for insurance companies  when you lose all your underwater medals  you miss your boating season like it's  done so it's over like it's the repair  is not gonna happen overnight  you're on the HAR before the insurance  the adjuster comes in they all agree for  the damage and they start and then they  have two other people a check that it's  not going to happen again you're out of  commission two months three months four  months that summer you lost your boat  and you're only going to find out when  at the start of the season when people  start boating when you put it in gear  and you don't feel anything you're like  it's not going what's going on I have no  props is my transmission not working  it's your prop is evaporated okay  the other big thing too is inverters  have this thing cheap and voters have  really high idle draw meaning that even  when you're not using it and nothing's  plugged in the wall and you said invert  it's going to draw a lot of amperage  just to have it on waiting for you is  huge some of the inverters are going to  draw more power than your refrigerator  just when they're on idle  that's huge remember I told you a  refrigerator is like 80% of your income  and inverters another 80% of something  you didn't have so I have some inverters  that draw an idle for 4 or 5 amps just  sitting there just waiting no they're  not doing anything they're just waiting  for you to put a load which is equal to  more than what the boat is drawing for  refrigeration so you've got to make sure  that you have low idle draw inverters  well you just don't buy a cheap one  anything that's brand name is fine  anybody any again this is the thing  people think that there's a deals nobody  shops with cars looking at least  expensive and like babe's I found it a  dollar my god I have no idea why people  who spend 20 grand on a car we found one  for a dollar smoking no no there's no  such thing  they're just removing all of the  features that you would in a good one  but you just don't know if P can you  wait for the N or is this relevant now  yeah just a couple I'll come back to you  ok  so pop  models that Trax is really popular it's  a budget inverter and then other ones  are Victor on zan tracks master volt is  amazing Magnum is really good again  brand names okay like there's lots of  choice  lots of choice there is no place on a  boat for a modified sine wave inverter  period it's a black and white statement  that choice was possible 20 years ago  when they were expensive I've been in  the business for only 12 years I have  never installed a modified sine-wave I  choose I refuse to in the beginning I  just I said no I can't do it it's not  sound it doesn't make sense  modified sine-wave inverters are okay so  it's sign sign is us the moon the  seasons like our moods are sinusoidal  everything in life the tides everything  is sinusoidal that's it it's slowly fall  spring winter summer all of that is  sinusoidal a sees the same thing and  what they did in in the late-1990s and  early-2000s true sine wave inverter x'  were expensive and they started making  what are called square waves so it would  be going from high tide to low tide in  an instant nearly like the water is  Scott I can be suddenly it's low tide  and then somebody's high tide no change  over what happens is that's okay  modified sine-wave square wave is okay  for resistive loads resistive loads are  your toaster heater anything like think  about a toaster it's just a heating  element no problem on a square wave no  problem inductive loads do not like  modified sine-wave and what's an  inductive load your microwave a TV a  sound system power tools battery  chargers an espresso machine blenders  it's pretty much everything that you  want  other than toaster is as true sine wave  and I had an order once call me  Serena's Russell's burned out first I  decided it's not a client first an  espresso goes out this is ridiculous  I bought an espresso and it failed this  is this isn't come on  brings back the Nespresso machine puts  it back on and you went on board fails  again I rate this is bad this is  ridiculous like come on people  it's a Nespresso you can't know  quality-control brings a third one on  board blows up again hmm I wonder if  it's me yeah yeah yeah what's the only  thing that's common here  oh you imagine the manufacturer had to  eat two inverters there's not thinking  it's going on a modified sine-wave right  cuz I get a call he's like - pretzels  are blowing up I have no idea why can  you come in sure enough  running a modified sine wave inverter  mind if I tell you we have an order if  you have one your microwave doesn't work  as well  you're on show power while it warms up  in two minutes or whatever you're  putting soup  you put it on modified sine-wave you  don't have to show a power it takes you  five because the microwave hates it some  people are gonna see lines on the TV you  know they're you know they're refresh  rate some people just have a really  amazing eye they'll see a line go down  the TV like I can't see it but I've had  a lot of boaters like yeah I'm seeing a  line come down the TV only on the  inverter as soon as you go to shore  power the line is away because again  it's a square wave there is no reason to  put a square wave inverter on your boat  and square wave inverter czar about like  five times as inefficient inefficient  I've had an order once where the fridge  was almost built around the boat like if  you take the fridge out you first cut it  off like you can't take it out there's  no door that's gonna I mean they  literally probably like haha you know  this Ridge is going it I don't know  where you gotta take it out but this is  hilarious then we put the fridge in they  did the cabinet's around like this thing  is in there like it's built in the boat  he's like changing the fridge would be  like like a mountain it's like you got  to cut it up there's no it's a custom  size there's no replacement it'd be  crazy and so the owner had a modified  sine wave inverter and the only reason  we change the inverter was a for a true  sine wave because a good true sine wave  inverter is only about 5% inefficient  and that modified sine away was 35% so  he saved 30% of his power draw to run  his fridge just by going with true sine  wave and that's made safe suddenly the  fridge got 30% more efficient and so  I've done that on a trawler was about a  55 foot trawler we just changed the  inverter for no other reason then I  can't change my fridge and I want the  power  efficiency so no.4 modified sine-wave  you go true or don't do it just don't do  it there's no reason honestly you're  gonna hate yourself you're gonna  honestly it's gonna be a bad decision  there's not a lot of shortcuts in life  that lead to good outcomes  okay very few and this would not be one  of them okay this is the list of things  that are required to properly install an  inverter and believe it or not that's  what six items not one percent of motors  have that it's too many variables it's  like 649 it would imply reading a manual  and nope nobody nobody can do it and the  challenge is the boat builders would do  it but very few boat builders install  inverters of the factory inverters are  generally a add-on at the commissioning  stage very few boats come with inverters  very few and if they do sometimes what  the boat builders do is they do it but  they don't really have it as part of  their spec sheet they added later and so  it doesn't go through the same tech department it's sort of like  get a done Department and the get it  done Department is not really bound by  having an tech read specs and tell  you what to do they just need to get it  done and when you get it done you  basically remember forget to put a caste  fuse that's super common or wrong fuse  tight they don't put you see you can see  one over here it's an on/off  service disconnect they don't have that  because you know it works without it  like my car true story I can drive my  car without ever puck buckling into my  seatbelt and it works fine but the flip  side is I also know through horror  stories that you're probably good idea  to buckle up and so you want a fuse and  an inverter disconnect the inverter only  neutral bus well that is way off  people's pay grade it's way too  complicated and involves surgery so  nobody does that  so it's hope that's the AC panel that it  works there's magic happening on the AC  system unrelated but it works so they  just let go  chassis Graham again it's like a seat  belt you don't really need it or it's  like you don't really need till you're  an accident and your chassis ground I've  seen that is over like 95 percent of  boats have it or don't even have the  right wire size again all of this is in  the match  by the way but is a 90 page manual DC  wire size again too expensive can't be  bothered didn't read the manual and so  they end up having the wires that are  connected to inverter charger or under  sized and the distance of the inverter  to the battery bank is too long again  all of this in the manual I'm not making  this stuff up but they don't do it and  then lastly is you can never ever ever  ever ever have an inverter charger in a  gasoline engine room and I see that in  about at least 20 percent of the  gasoline boats we survey and the reason  is they didn't read the manual and if I  had a charger there and this is an  inverter charger same word must be the  same and hence they install it and an  inverter there is no such thing as an  ignition protected inverter charger no  such thing it does not exist there's not  a single one out there and then what  people do is they get creative  they don't install an engine room but  they create a huge hole in the install  and above and sort of where the let's  say their fridges and they're like well  it's not in the engine room I'm like yes  you've met this the letter of the law  but the spirit of the law is that your  engine room is just there like they're  communicating the vapors don't stop at  the arbitrary ceiling like if it's an  open hole it's gonna go up he's like  yeah I guess I didn't think of that I'm  like yeah you did and I mean now you can  go out and I tell people all the time  you got to remember this this is the  craziest thing about boats is that all  of us have a different risk profile in  life all of us some people are pretty  safety-conscious some people aren't the  challenge with a boat is you can go  skydiving by yourself but when you go  boating you're bringing other people for  the ride and they don't know what your  risk tolerance is right they're not sort  of questioning like are we doing  skydiving are we gonna have one  parachute or two are you are you trained  do you know what you're doing right they  assume and that's what happens is that's  what's so disconcerting for some of us  is you assume that this other boater is  sort of like the minimum bar like  they're not gonna be willing to do  things just for time or money to  sacrifice their lives but you'd be  surprised that if people didn't have to  have a seat belt in their car and it was  an option and they could remove $75 off  the build most people  would choose to remove a seatbelt  parking brakes airbags they would remove  the options because they figure well  it's not gonna happen to me and that's  why a lot of stuff on boats are  shortcuts but if you're super safety  conscious maybe for yourself or maybe  because of your loved ones  it depends some people are some people  aren't you got to ask yourself and you  worry about the previous owner that  wasn't and so when I tell people you buy  about don't just buy the boat by the  previous owner  his philosophy or her philosophy of boat  ownership is what affects everything  that they did from a maintenance  perspective on that boat and I always  tell you should make sure you buy a boat  from someone who's like minded to you  because if they took shortcuts they  didn't and they're taking shortcuts and  they didn't let you they're not putting  tags everywhere or here's a shortcut I  took I showed it shortcut shortcut  shortcut shortcut it's for you to  uncover that over time and then you end  up spending crazy amount of money to  undo the shortcuts and that's where boat  ownership is so expensive is because you  end up fixing other people's mistakes  so our with that I'm gonna open the  floor to questions any questions on  inverter inverter Chargers when I'm sure  power generator should I turn should I  close off or turn off my inverter so the  answer is yes and no at the same time at  the same time and this is very important  remember most in voters nowadays are  inverted Chargers so on your AC panel  you should and if you don't you need one  and that's another thing that's missing  you should have a breaker that says  inverter on your AC panel there should  be a breaker somewhere that says  inverter you should have that that  breaker should never ever ever ever ever  be turned off because if you turn that  off you're not just shutting off the  inverter you're also you're shutting off  the AC going into the inverter which is  feeding either pass-through or charger  you're not actually shutting down the  inverter you're shutting down  pass-through and charger hence why it's  so complicated because an inverter  Chargers two things unfortunately a lot  of the manufacturers of panels don't  have inverter charger as a sticker and  so the only sticker they have is  inverter so you should never ever shut  off your inverter  at VA cpanel because when you do that  you not only stop AC going through the  inverter you stop AC going to the  inverter charger and the charger needs  AC to recharge your batteries so that's  the no part never ever disconnect your  inverter charger the AC panel ever its  circuit protection it's like your  breakers in your house somewhere in  their basement how often do you go turn  those on and off never unless you're  playing with something but they're  always there their protection  it's a thermal circuit breaker that if  it trips you can reset it's only there  for protection it's not they're meant  for be a switch okay yeah that's right  that's right but then Verta gets  complicated too but let's let's do with  inverted charger because it affects 90%  95% then then ad mean rotor you should  have a remote panel or the inverter  itself should have a button and if you  don't you need one that you can disable  the inverter on a little on/off button  you say to the inverter over a telephone  wire I want you to stop being an  inverter so yes you should you should  disable your inverter at a control panel  or the inverter itself when you're on  Shore power or connected to a generator  if you want it because you don't need an  inverter at that point and you don't  want your inverter to turn on when it  doesn't need to so it's complicated  right this it's not easy but that's the  rule never disconnect at the AC panel  ever ever  that's a black and white and at the  remote panel you can turn it on or off  but do so like I always encourage people  to not have the inverter enabled when  they are away from the boat for months  on end because you know why your  inverter to turn on and run your fridge  or your heater for two hours and kill  your batteries you're going to lose  what's in the fridge you're gonna lose  the heat in your boat anyways an extra  two hours won't make a difference don't  have your inverter keep your boat warm  because I told you you can't make hot  water with batteries you can't certainly  heat your boat with batteries it's not  gonna work inverters also have  pass-through so if it's an inverter that  has passed through you want to leave  that inverter breaker there as well  because that's the input which means if  you don't have a  see going in there's no a/c going out  the way to shut off in a small little  inverter is to stop the DC sight on the  supply because an inverter pulls DC  pushes out AC right that's what an  inverter does a converter does the  opposite it takes AC makes DC and  inverter takes DC and goes to AC  remember they're opposite directions and  so I know I'm here myself I'm like oh my  god this is so hard with so mental but  that's the rule so the question is if I  have an inverter charger and I have two  battery banks on my boat I have simply a  house battery and an engine battery and  I have an inverter charger and my  inverter charger only has a single  output how will my inverter charger  charge back my engine battery if it's  connected to my house one way would be  having another AC to DC device which  again is a charger a single output  charger just for that battery or one  thing we're going to talk in the  afternoon because we're going to stop  after this another way would be a  battery combiner would be a way to share  a charge from one battery to another  battery and that's how you would do that  and that's a battery combiner okay so  either a battery charger a dedicated  battery charger or battery combiners  let's be back for 1:30 okay